Dr. Matthew Walker: The Science & Practice of Perfecting Your Sleep | Huberman Lab Podcast #31
Myth of Magnesium
We do have lots of studies that have just looked at magnesium in general for sleep. And overall, the data is uncompelling.
And for a while, I was confused as to why, where did this come from this kind of myth of magnesium?
So I started looking back into the literature and I've best traced it at least as far as I can tell, to early studies showing that those who are deficient in magnesium also had sleep problems. They had other problems too, of course, but sleep problems were one of that set of sequelae that came from having lower magnesium. And when they supplemented with magnesium and tried to restore those levels, some of those sleep problems dissipated.
And then that seems to have gotten lost in sort of some game of sort of like whispers around the room and it's become translated into people who don't have sleep problems, who are healthy sleepers, and who are healthy in general, and who have healthy normal levels of magnesium, if they take more magnesium, they will sleep better. And the data really, there is not good.
Once again, the only study that I've seen where magnesium did have some efficacy was in a study with older adults,
I think they were 60 to 80 years old, it may have been exclusively women, now I think about it and they also had insomnia. And in that population, you did see some benefits.
And my guess is that because it's an older community as well, they were probably deficient in magnesium.
So they fit the former category of simply when you're deficient, and you restore, you can help sleep sort of return to normal.
But if you are not deficient and you're healthy, and you're not old and you don't have insomnia, and you're supplementing thinking that it provides sleep, right now, the data isn't supportive of that.
Can Magnesium Supplements Really Help You Sleep?
Magnesium is often touted as an antidote to poor sleep. But while some doctors say it is fine to take it in supplemental form for certain sleep disruptions, like those caused by restless legs syndrome, the evidence for its sleep-inducing benefits is thin.
Magnesium, an abundant mineral in the body, plays a critical role in many physiological functions. It helps support immune health, blood sugar regulation, and nerve and muscle function. Some scientists suspect that magnesium deficiencies can contribute to poor sleep by disrupting nerve signaling and altering levels of sleep-inducing hormones such as melatonin.
But most people have sufficient levels of magnesium, since the mineral is easy to get if you follow a relatively healthy diet. It’s found in a variety of plant and animal foods like nuts, greens, seeds, beans, yogurt and fish. And although many people fall short of the federal government’s recommended daily intake, true magnesium deficiencies are rare.
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I've been taking Magnesium 400 für die Nacht and now I'm bewildered.
Myth of valerian
Valerian often touted as a beneficial sleep aid and lots of people swear by it too. But the evidence is actually quite against that. Not that it makes your sleep worse, but of at least the seven good studies that I've been able to find, and typically these are of the nature of what we call a randomized placebo crossover design. And I won't bore people with what that means it's sort of one of the sort of gold standard methods that we have when we're looking at intervention studies such as drugs studies. Five of the seven found no benefits of Valerian root on sleep. Then two out of the seven, the data was just insufficient. I think it was a power issue where they just couldn't make any strong conclusions.
And then I think there was the most recent study, I think looked at two different doses of Valerian and I could have this wrong and they just failed to find any effects once again, but the stunning part of that paper, as I recall, they had this big table with all of the different sleep metrics that they looked at. And there were well over 25 different things that they tried to see if valerian impacted. And none of them were significant, which stuns me because from statistical probabilities, we know, if you just randomly perform 25 statistical tests, chances are probabilistically, you'll just get one significant result by random chance. And even with random chance on their side, they still couldn't find a benefit of Valerian. 😅
- So Valerian root might be worse than nothing at all, if there is, so to speak.
- I mean, again, placebo effect we can think about that too. And I would say that if you feel as though it's having a benefit for you, and with all of the caveats that we have with supplements, things like melatonin purity, concentration, et cetera, you know, maybe it's no harm no foul.
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When I saw a doctor for horrible insomnia couple of years ago the doctor prescribed me this 'Baldrian Tabletten' and it turns out, there's no scientific evidence of this 'Baldrian Tee / Tabletten'. It's shocking because here in Germany you always see these Baldrian products on the drug-shelf.
Worry journal
The other thing about sort of that idea of shifting focus away from your mind itself, get your mind off itself is a good piece of advice. Catharsis, you can try to write down all of the concerns that you have, and do this not right before bed, but usually an hour or two before bed. Some people call it a worry journal.
And to me, it's a little bit like closing down all of the emotional tabs on my browser. Because if I shut the computer down and all of those tabs are still open, I'm going to come back in the morning, and the computer's red hot the fans going because it didn't go to sleep, because it couldn't because there were too many tabs active and open. I think it's the same way with sleep as well, so try to think about doing that. So just vomit out all of your concerns on the page.
- I like that, cause my 3am waking is often associated with me writing down the list of things that I forgot to do that I need to do. And once I eventually wake up from the later night, second half of the night's sleep, that stuff seems much more tractable and reasonable, but it sure would be great to get that stuff out of the way before sleep.
- Well, there's also something that I don't think people have spoken about a lot. And I'd like to research it, which is difficulty and anxiety at night in the dark, is not the same difficulty and anxiety in the light of day.
And when we have those thoughts at night, it comes with a magnitude of rumination and catastrophization that is disproportionate to that which you would describe when you are awake. And I don't know what's going on about the brain, and thought and emotion at the time, I've got a bunch of theories as to why, and that's why I like the idea of closing up, zipping up all of those different components, just get them out on the page. And I at first thought this just sounds like, it sounds very Berkeley, it's kind of Kumbaya, we all hold hands, and we all come at the end of the day. But then the data started coming out really good studies from good people. And they found that keeping one of those journals decreased the time it takes you to fall asleep by 50%, five, zero.
- I'm convinced that I've long thought that the worries and concerns and ideas I have at three, 4am I've learned to not place any stock in them.
Because something, I'm glad that you might decide to eventually look at this in your laboratory because I feel like something is melted away or altered. I suspect it's in the regulation of the autonomic nervous system, that it makes sense why a concern at three, 4am ought to evoke more of a panic sense than a concern sense. And certainly, that's my experience, although not, fortunate to not suffer from full blown panic attacks. But everything seems worse at three, 4am provided you're awake.
And...
💆🏻♀️ this is a Lullaby for you... 🌚
Matt Walker - California Lullaby ft. Andrew Huberman (juanjo_sound Remix)